The "feels" bazaar.

A forum for general discussion of the game: Open to all punters
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gRaViJa
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by gRaViJa » Thu Feb 09, 2012 5:49 pm

Good post. You really analyzed everything well. My main problem now is that i had a rough time behind me, but now i want to go out there and experience stuff like this again, but the problem is that i'm out of highschool and college as well (theoretically) and that i won't have a chance to get in those typical situations anymore. DAMNIT! >< got any advize on that? ;)
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5k personal record: 27m48
1 mile personal record: 6m59

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odnsfvn
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by odnsfvn » Thu Feb 09, 2012 6:15 pm

gRaViJa wrote:Good post. You really analyzed everything well. My main problem now is that i had a rough time behind me, but now i want to go out there and experience stuff like this again, but the problem is that i'm out of highschool and college as well (theoretically) and that i won't have a chance to get in those typical situations anymore. DAMNIT! >< got any advize on that? ;)
Actually, this is exactly the situation I am in as well. And because of the things you mentioned, it is harder than when we still were younger. You (and I) can only accept that we are too old for living through these specific times again. There are some VNs that focus on elder protagonists, like "Chain - the lost footsteps" or "Sekai de Ichiban" (but this one is JP only). So you can get the feeling that at least something like that could happen to you. In the first one you play a private detective (who got a fkn. hot secretary imo), in the second you play a divorced unlucky guy (but I havent played this one yet - have to improve japanese first). Thats the solution if you wanna play vns. If you just get over it, it seems to be harder - if you got a good solution, please tell me. Saying goodbye to even the possibility of experiencing something like that is what brought me down hard this time. But you have to force yourself to keep in mind that the stories you read are idealistic. How many times did you try to get a girl irl and it didn't work out. How many times did you try something and were simply ignored. vns all have one premise that does not go for rl: the protagonist has the possibility to get who he wants (most of the time). Realizing that even if you were younger, there would be no 100% chance you would experience something like that maybe helps getting over the fact that you are now too old for it.

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hickwarrior
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by hickwarrior » Thu Feb 09, 2012 6:25 pm

gRaViJa wrote:Good post. You really analyzed everything well. My main problem now is that i had a rough time behind me, but now i want to go out there and experience stuff like this again, but the problem is that i'm out of highschool and college as well (theoretically) and that i won't have a chance to get in those typical situations anymore. DAMNIT! >< got any advize on that? ;)
Sign up on a dating site.

In all seriousness though, it's probably if you find some place where people tend to gather. Get yourself familiar with the place for a bit first, with some of the regulars, and afterwards try to look for a woman you're interested in at that place. I'm just operating out of logic here, but I'm pretty sure that this could help. Of course, this IS assuming that you are kind of a sociable person to begin with.

OT: I think I gotten over it, and feeling more determined to just get on with myself. After having played a game(I don't call VNs games, they are more like books anyways.), thinking over what I've experienced, coming on these forums to discuss this VN and telling my parents that I was feeling lonely, I'm kind of fine right now. Maybe this thread can turn into how to cope with the experience KS left behind.

BTW, I didn't really think my GF died, if I had any. What I actually thought was that the story had closure for the reader, but let the character's have their own future. What I'm getting at here, is that their lives go on and you have read the story of how they met and what trouble they went through. Especially Lilly's epilogue felt like closure to me, and left me thinking how happy the character's are with one another.

The stories still gut punched me and made my feeling of loneliness that much more obvious. I'm not sure whether I should consider myself an emotional person, but I guess after loving Lilly's arc, I might say so. It was definitely romantic.
Meh, I just liked how the location sounded in my mind. I'm not really into sailing myself.

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Titus
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by Titus » Thu Feb 09, 2012 7:03 pm

What a thoughtful post OP!

Posting and bumping because I know there are people just as you described on here, and hopefully your wonderful advice will reach them.
What if life had a soundtrack similar to Katawa Shoujo's ?

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newnar
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by newnar » Thu Feb 09, 2012 8:23 pm

That is such an informative & analytic OP. I really can't see how anyone could've put it better. You're the Sigmund Freud of KS.
I am a guy.
I sometimes talk like Rin Tezuka.
I am in love with Hanako Ikezawa.
NoOne3 wrote:Imagine a male Rin who secretly likes Hanako.
this
YES I AM. DEAL WITH IT.

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gRaViJa
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by gRaViJa » Thu Feb 09, 2012 8:35 pm

Now thinking a bit more before i post, unlike my last post here, i think many people also might feel so empty because the girls in KS are actually not realistic, they are ideals.

@ odnsfvn: Don't feel to bad about having lost your teenage life like i did. There are still chances to meet people in such a way. For example, I was thinking about joining an athletics club before KS, but KS might just be that little push that draws me over the line. Who know who i'll meet there?

@ hickwarrior: i'm thinking about a sports clubs and a sort of art club that a girl invited me to a while ago. You have any other ideas?
Emi's Couch to 5k
Completed!
6k personal record: 29m07
5k personal record: 27m48
1 mile personal record: 6m59

100 push-up challenge
Week 7: 25/25/25/25

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newnar
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by newnar » Thu Feb 09, 2012 9:00 pm

gRaViJa wrote:Now thinking a bit more before i post, unlike my last post here, i think many people also might feel so empty because the girls in KS are actually not realistic, they are ideals.
Ideals? In what sense? I don't see how they are cliche love interests from any random tvshow/anime/movie.
I am a guy.
I sometimes talk like Rin Tezuka.
I am in love with Hanako Ikezawa.
NoOne3 wrote:Imagine a male Rin who secretly likes Hanako.
this
YES I AM. DEAL WITH IT.

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encrypted12345
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by encrypted12345 » Thu Feb 09, 2012 9:04 pm

newnar wrote:
gRaViJa wrote:Now thinking a bit more before i post, unlike my last post here, i think many people also might feel so empty because the girls in KS are actually not realistic, they are ideals.
Ideals? In what sense? I don't see how they are cliche love interests from any random tvshow/anime/movie.
True. Ideals are one-sided and unrealistic. The characters here are realistic enough that I can see people like them being real. This VN wouldn't have had so much power otherwise. Only a die-hard cynic would not think so.

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GINDAW
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by GINDAW » Thu Feb 09, 2012 9:27 pm

This is... pretty fucking impressive. I mean, I've only played through a handful of visual-novels, none of which were romance, and I could not JUSTIFY this fucking sorrow I felt after finishing just Emi's story. It's damned ridiculous that a game can tug at you in so many ways and leave you feeling hollow when it's done.
Combining a video-game's interactivity with the deep story-telling and character investment of a book has some amazingly tightened effects.
But, still, I guess I'm getting over it. It's still a damned shame Four Leaf will never be making any more games in this universe/setting, I think the aesthetic appeal of Yamaku is something that would be extremely hard to pull-off, elsewhere, but it damn well got under my skin.
Image
On break, right now. I'll finish it later.

GaseousMask
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by GaseousMask » Thu Feb 09, 2012 9:43 pm

odnsfvn wrote:
The real problem is when the game ends! Only then do you realize one thing: Because the game ends at a certain point, there is no more line to read, no more expression to see, no more dialogue to start, and no more relationship to have. The girl you started your relationship with, now dies. In a metaphorical meaning, but it feels just like that. You are not gonna get in touch with her ever again, read just one line of her thoughts. Notice that these symptoms and feelings may be stronger for one reader than for another - for me, they almost every time busted me completely.
So the real problem seems to be that you became... well... happy while building a relationship, not knowing how it will turn out, being full of excitement and hope. Dealing with your girl, you come to like her (some even write love), although you absolutely know that "your girl" is a character which was born in the creativity of a writer. As long as the story is there and you still have lines to read, you don't (or don't want to) realize that. But after completing the arc, it strikes you. While playing, dating, protecting, flirting and witnessing the progress in your relationship, it seems that you produced a huge load of serotonine ("happy hormones"), which you produce as well when dating a real girl irl. But while your real girl does not disappear, and you enjoy your relationship, this flow abruptly ends with completion of the vn, and what follows, is withdrawal (is this the right term? i am not a genuine english speaker). Thats what I meant with your gf dying.

OdnsfVN
That hit me hard...

Posting on the forums have helped me get rid of the feels. Although its still there because its one of the most emotional thing i've experienced but it did help a lot.

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micechasekittens
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by micechasekittens » Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:49 pm

My way has been learning the soundtrack on piano, mainly the pieces from Hanako's path. It is like keeping a piece of the experience with me every time I play the piece and honoring the character when I learned it. Don't want to give the impression that I'm head over heels for Hanako (lol okay maybe a little bit), but I do this with any piece of media that really moved me. Rule of Rose had me bawling at the end due to its story so I learned the main theme, Last Unicorn was a beloved childhood movie so I learned that too. etc etc I get this bittersweet content feeling when I finally nail down a piece, because it is like taking a piece of the experience always with me.

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hickwarrior
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by hickwarrior » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:39 am

@gRaViJa: I'd say try the things out that she invited you for. Who knows, you might find something else enjoyable to do. Just keep an open mind about it.
Meh, I just liked how the location sounded in my mind. I'm not really into sailing myself.

odnsfvn
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by odnsfvn » Fri Feb 10, 2012 11:19 am

hickwarrior wrote: BTW, I didn't really think my GF died, if I had any. What I actually thought was that the story had closure for the reader, but let the character's have their own future. What I'm getting at here, is that their lives go on and you have read the story of how they met and what trouble they went through. Especially Lilly's epilogue felt like closure to me, and left me thinking how happy the character's are with one another.

The stories still gut punched me and made my feeling of loneliness that much more obvious. I'm not sure whether I should consider myself an emotional person, but I guess after loving Lilly's arc, I might say so. It was definitely romantic.
Thats the thing I wanted to point out. You are (I am) not able to draw this inner line between what is a relationship between the characters and whats a relationship between a character and me. Through the way the story is narrated. You are playing the protagonist, you have thoughts, you are the one who gets addressed by the other characters. I think that it would be much easier for me if the story would have been told in 3rd person: "Hisao walks across the campus. He thinks that ..." Using 1st person kinda nihilates the borders between you and the protagonist, and the price you are paying comes along when you are about to leave the world you have been dragged into.
Edit: Forgot to mention: And now think about this: In KS you dont have voices - in most of nowadays' VNs you have voice acting as well. So your girl even speaks to you. Although you don't understand her if you don't speak Japanese, you even have a voice attached to her. This, plus the 1st person, plus bgm, plus well-drawn cg (cuteness-factor) just gives you no chance to stay outside :/
I am happy for you that you can obviously draw this line. I can't, it seems. But the question is: Would the VN be as good as it is now, if you were too distant from the story and the characters? I don't think so. For me, a huge part of it heavily relies on the mentioned fuzzy borders between protagonist and reader. Because only then you are motivated and thrilled to help your girl, get to know her, "discover" her (and thats not meant in an h-way).

BTW: thanks for your replies, I hope I could be of any help to someone, since we are all sitting in the same boat. Looking forward to more, as this helps me as well :)

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hickwarrior
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by hickwarrior » Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:48 pm

odnsfvn wrote:
hickwarrior wrote: BTW, I didn't really think my GF died, if I had any. What I actually thought was that the story had closure for the reader, but let the character's have their own future. What I'm getting at here, is that their lives go on and you have read the story of how they met and what trouble they went through. Especially Lilly's epilogue felt like closure to me, and left me thinking how happy the character's are with one another.

The stories still gut punched me and made my feeling of loneliness that much more obvious. I'm not sure whether I should consider myself an emotional person, but I guess after loving Lilly's arc, I might say so. It was definitely romantic.
Thats the thing I wanted to point out. You are (I am) not able to draw this inner line between what is a relationship between the characters and whats a relationship between a character and me. Through the way the story is narrated. You are playing the protagonist, you have thoughts, you are the one who gets addressed by the other characters. I think that it would be much easier for me if the story would have been told in 3rd person: "Hisao walks across the campus. He thinks that ..." Using 1st person kinda nihilates the borders between you and the protagonist, and the price you are paying comes along when you are about to leave the world you have been dragged into.
Edit: Forgot to mention: And now think about this: In KS you dont have voices - in most of nowadays' VNs you have voice acting as well. So your girl even speaks to you. Although you don't understand her if you don't speak Japanese, you even have a voice attached to her. This, plus the 1st person, plus bgm, plus well-drawn cg (cuteness-factor) just gives you no chance to stay outside :/
I am happy for you that you can obviously draw this line. I can't, it seems. But the question is: Would the VN be as good as it is now, if you were too distant from the story and the characters? I don't think so. For me, a huge part of it heavily relies on the mentioned fuzzy borders between protagonist and reader. Because only then you are motivated and thrilled to help your girl, get to know her, "discover" her (and thats not meant in an h-way).
I can see that. Some people can draw that line, or just think of closure. Anyway, maybe it was because I knew what I was getting into. I already had this fuzzy feeling inside and never really quite grasped what a relationship is. I think the moment I felt those emotions was the moment I knew I was in trouble if I didn't keep some distance between me and the story. Although, it could also be a lie of what I was thinking at the time. Regardless, I think something did snap me into such conclusions.
Meh, I just liked how the location sounded in my mind. I'm not really into sailing myself.

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Robnonymous
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Re: To all of you who are experiencing "the pain" - an appro

Post by Robnonymous » Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:43 am

I write, therefor I COMBAT THE FEELS!
Bad Dreams (Hanako) - My first KS fanfic. it's actually a happy story
Reconciliation - (a Hanako bad-end story) - My second KS fanfic. Not all that happy.

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