Re-reading KS after many other VNs

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Xanatos
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Xanatos » Wed Jul 18, 2012 9:54 pm

Camoufrage wrote:Just like a few people before me said, goin through KS a second time isn't as good. All the twists and turns that pulled at your heart strings are gone. Plus you know everything about the character and what happens. Simply not as interesting.
That can be said of just about everything though. Movies, TV episodes, games, other VNs...Once you know it, going through again will lack something.

I find it still manages to pull the right strings. It's just lost the suspense, as anything does when revisited.
Last edited by Xanatos on Wed Jul 18, 2012 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Camoufrage
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Camoufrage » Wed Jul 18, 2012 9:57 pm

Xanatos wrote:
Camoufrage wrote:Just like a few people before me said, goin through KS a second time isn't as good. All the twists and turns that pulled at your heart strings are gone. Plus you know everything about the character and what happens. Simply not as interesting.
That can be said of just about everything though. Movies, TV episodes, games...Once you know it, going through again will lack something.

I find it still manages to pull the right strings. It's just lost the suspense, as anything does when revisited.
Yep, the same thing CAN be said about other media. When I watch TV show reruns they're never as good as when I first saw it. Deep enough pieces of media can have a better second run though (Watchmen is a good example)

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Enemy |
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Enemy | » Wed Jul 18, 2012 11:09 pm

Sometimes a second run can be better though. You pick up all the subtle stuff you missed from your first run, since now you already know the overall picture.

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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Xanatos » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:11 pm

Enemy | wrote:Sometimes a second run can be better though. You pick up all the subtle stuff you missed from your first run, since now you already know the overall picture.
Very true. I'm enjoying my second Lilly run a bit more for that. All of her and Akira's suspicious glances and asides are still entirely troubling but now because I know why...

Also how it worked with me and Twin Peaks...Particularly the movie, given I had no idea what was happening the first time.
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by ravenlord » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:21 pm

I've done all of the routes twice, and I've done Shizune and Hanako three times. And definitely, what you lose in suspense you make up for in depth and detail. This is the only VN that I have ever replayed in major detail, just because there is so much to glean from it!
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by TheSongofRaven » Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:43 pm

for me , simple unistalled and reinstall that. That's the only game that i keep fresh till this time on my notebook :D
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Babli » Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:42 pm

I think one of the main reasons (at least for me) that KS is so special, is that it was written be westerners. We have different mindsets, philosophies etc. Even small stuff, like easter eggs and pop culture references and stuff like that. Its much closer to us.

>implying everyone on this forum is westerner

AlsoI if you played enough of japanese VNs you notice usual clichés in characters. You hear their voice, see their hair and posture and you immediately know, what you can expect from that character for rest of the game. Obviously I am generalizing here a lot, but I have that problem with japanese characters in general lately, with only a few exceptions. But on the other hand KS characters were varied, colorful, enjoyable, unique and most importantly, they broke a lot of clichés and tropes. And thats what made them really deep.

I feel like I wanted to say something else, but i am tired, going to sleep.

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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by WorldlyWiseman » Thu Jul 19, 2012 10:54 pm

It's entirely possible that while KS was your first and left the biggest impression, it didn't have all of the elements that make your brain tick, and that after finding a few more examples that may have had more of those elements that you craved.

Video game example, it's like your first game being Half-Life and playing it to death, but trying Portal at some point later and finding that you never really cared for the whole shooting thing, you just wanted to explore cool environments and fly around the place. When going back to Half-life, you would be a little annoyed at having to stop and have a firefight every couple of minutes and it just wouldn't be the same.

I think this is the effect that Brogurt was referring to with his 'babby's first' crack.

As for my own experience:

I didn't actually BUY any other VNs, but I read/watched some Let's Plays, and I found a lot of them kind of insulting for their use of pandering characters, manipulative storytelling, and stupidly done fantastical elements. I love a good fantasy as much as the next guy, but the writers should at least TRY to apply real-world logic to these things. My experience may not be broad, but I think I've sampled enough to know that KS has a stronger connection to the real world and an actual emotional core that isn't just a giant dollar sign.
Xanatos wrote: I've seen $500+ shelled out for crappy Atari titles. It's really just easier not to question some things...
There's a world of difference between paying a huge sum for a rare game that is no longer printed, and paying for one of a controlled number of collector's editions with a bunch of posters and booklets enclosed (which is what I think is being referred to in the $100+ VN example). One involves free will, the other is just manipulative marketing.

Babli wrote:I think one of the main reasons (at least for me) that KS is so special, is that it was written be westerners. We have different mindsets, philosophies etc. Even small stuff, like easter eggs and pop culture references and stuff like that. Its much closer to us.

>implying everyone on this forum is westerner


Are you being ironically racist or accidentally racist or what? :(
Being dumb here, disregard
Last edited by WorldlyWiseman on Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Xanatos
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Xanatos » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:03 pm

WorldlyWiseman wrote:There's a world of difference between paying a huge sum for a rare game that is no longer printed, and paying for one of a controlled number of collector's editions with a bunch of posters and booklets enclosed (which is what I think is being referred to in the $100+ VN example). One involves free will, the other is just manipulative marketing.
No, there really isn't. People will pay inordinate sums for things they really want, whether it's a collector's edition VN, a rare-but-shitty video game that nobody ever wants to play anyway, or any other overpriced-to-everyone-but-themselves thing. It's all free will either way.
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stanman237
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by stanman237 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:07 pm

The $100+ VNs from Key are the Regular Edition, but they are usually extremely long. Clannad being 200+ hours and Little Busters even longer.

KS on the other hand is definitely a good VN but it lacks in some areas like the amount of choices and the sound of some of the soundtracks. Moment of Decision was great but Red Velvet sounded pretty bad, especially the saxophone part. What is special about KS is that it sticks to realism with a lot of character development on all the routes, something that is hard to do.

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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Xanatos » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:08 pm

stanman237 wrote:The $100+ VNs from Key are the Regular Edition, but they are usually extremely long. Clannad being 200+ hours and Little Busters even longer.

KS on the other hand is definitely a good VN but it lacks in some areas like the amount of choices and the sound of some of the soundtracks. Moment of Decision was great but Red Velvet sounded pretty bad, especially the saxophone part. What is special about KS is that it sticks to realism with a lot of character development on all the routes, something that is hard to do.
Yeah, it doesn't have a heavy amount of choices...I liked Red Velvet though.
<KeiichiO>: "I wonder what Misha's WAHAHA's sound like with a cock stuffed down her throat..."
<Ascension>: "I laughed, cried, vomited in my mouth a little, and even had time for marshmallows afterwards. Well played, Xanatos. Well played."
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Camoufrage » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:37 pm

Xanatos wrote:
stanman237 wrote:The $100+ VNs from Key are the Regular Edition, but they are usually extremely long. Clannad being 200+ hours and Little Busters even longer.

KS on the other hand is definitely a good VN but it lacks in some areas like the amount of choices and the sound of some of the soundtracks. Moment of Decision was great but Red Velvet sounded pretty bad, especially the saxophone part. What is special about KS is that it sticks to realism with a lot of character development on all the routes, something that is hard to do.
Yeah, it doesn't have a heavy amount of choices...I liked Red Velvet though.
I like almost all of KS's music... I have he music box downloaded and I listen to it from time to time. Obviously there are some bad ones (I dont even know the names LOL) but the vast majority of them are pretty much great.\

EDIT:
Good stuff:
Lullaby of Open Eyes
Cold Iron
Parity
Painful History
Shadow of the Truth
Damage
Caged Heart
Air Guitar
Aria de I'Etoile
THREE STARS
TEATIME, FAST FORWARD
JITTER
INNOCENCE
CLOUDLAND SWING CLOUDLAND SWING CLOUDLAND SWING


Bad stuff:
School Days
Fripperies
Ah Eh I Oh You

I made thi after sampling them all. Obviously the ones in caps I had enjoyed the most. Especially Cloudland Swing always makes my tummy all warm and fuzzy :lol:
Red Velvet

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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Sajomir » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:44 pm

I did the same thing recently. I think KS loses something the second time you play through, but that could really be said of any VN. Just like a book, you really have to give yourself time in between reads.

The other thing I did notice is that each path in KS is rather short compared to commercial VNs. Nothing wrong with that, but especially when you're speed reading the second time through or skipping less favorite scenes, it just fliiiies by.
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Xanatos
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Xanatos » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:51 pm

Camoufrage wrote:
Xanatos wrote:
stanman237 wrote:The $100+ VNs from Key are the Regular Edition, but they are usually extremely long. Clannad being 200+ hours and Little Busters even longer.

KS on the other hand is definitely a good VN but it lacks in some areas like the amount of choices and the sound of some of the soundtracks. Moment of Decision was great but Red Velvet sounded pretty bad, especially the saxophone part. What is special about KS is that it sticks to realism with a lot of character development on all the routes, something that is hard to do.
Yeah, it doesn't have a heavy amount of choices...I liked Red Velvet though.
I like almost all of KS's music... I have he music box downloaded and I listen to it from time to time. Obviously there are some bad ones (I dont even know the names LOL) but the vast majority of them are pretty much great.\

EDIT:
Good stuff:
Lullaby of Open Eyes
Cold Iron
Parity
Painful History
Shadow of the Truth
Damage
Caged Heart
Air Guitar
Aria de I'Etoile
THREE STARS
TEATIME, FAST FORWARD
JITTER
INNOCENCE
CLOUDLAND SWING CLOUDLAND SWING CLOUDLAND SWING


Bad stuff:
School Days
Fripperies
Ah Eh I Oh You

I made thi after sampling them all. Obviously the ones in caps I had enjoyed the most. Especially Cloudland Swing always makes my tummy all warm and fuzzy :lol:
Red Velvet
Aw, I really like School Days...Fripperies is just sort of generic. And I don't recall the other one.

And I like the music box tune from Lilly's arc...I actually recognized it playing during Lilly's good end before Hisao did. :lol: And Parity's always good.
<KeiichiO>: "I wonder what Misha's WAHAHA's sound like with a cock stuffed down her throat..."
<Ascension>: "I laughed, cried, vomited in my mouth a little, and even had time for marshmallows afterwards. Well played, Xanatos. Well played."
<KeiichiO>: "That's a beautiful response to chocolate."

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Babli
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Re: Re-reading KS after many other VNs

Post by Babli » Fri Jul 20, 2012 10:11 am

Babli wrote:I think one of the main reasons (at least for me) that KS is so special, is that it was written be westerners. We have different mindsets, philosophies etc. Even small stuff, like easter eggs and pop culture references and stuff like that. Its much closer to us.

>implying everyone on this forum is westerner
Are you being ironically racist or accidentally racist or what? :(
lolwut. I am just saying that not everyone on this forum is from "west" countries. Just majority of people. If you reffering to the first part of the post, then no, there is nothing racist in that. People, cultures and philosophies, outlooks on life are different in different countries.

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