Team Shizune vs Team Lilly

[Megumeru]

You know, I just have that feel that we--participants in this board--has practically wring out this topic dry.

Congratulations...is in order?

[Oddball]

You know, I just have that feel that we--participants in this board--has practically wring out this topic dry.

Congratulations...is in order?

Next topic, Team Hanako vs Team Emi!... or ... not.

[Dawnstorm]

You know, I just have that feel that we--participants in this board--has practically wring out this topic dry.

Congratulations...is in order?

Next topic, Team Hanako vs Team Emi!... or ... not.

I'm for Team Yuuko vs. Team Kenji. I'd be curious where they get their team mates from.

[TheMaskedWriter]

Team Lilly vs. Team Hanako

Let the butthurt flow through you.

[ShadeHaven]

Team Lilly vs. Team Hanako

Let the butthurt flow through you.

Naa, that's Team Emi...

[Another Guest]

Team Lilly vs. Team Hanako

Let the butthurt flow through you.

Naa, that's Team Emi...

Team Emi vs Team Track Captain. The ultimate showdown.


Team Rin vs Team Manly Picnic sounds fair to me.

[Hisao Nakai]

Team Lilly vs. Team Hanako

Let the butthurt flow through you.

[Walrusfella]

Team Lilly vs. Team Hanako

Let the butthurt flow through you.

I'm afraid that would violate the Team L/H non-aggression pact I just made up.

[Mysterious Stranger]

Two can play at this game, Mr. Nakai.

[themocaw]

So everyone gives Shizune a lot of flak for not responding to Hisao saying he loves her at her ending.

Did he actually sign it too?

I figured it was one of those, "tell the deaf girl my deepest thoughts because I know she can't hear me" things, like her first H scene.

[Mirrormn]

So everyone gives Shizune a lot of flak for not responding to Hisao saying he loves her at her ending.

Did he actually sign it too?

I figured it was one of those, "tell the deaf girl my deepest thoughts because I know she can't hear me" things, like her first H scene.

It's a bit difficult to tell. During that scene, Hisao speaks to Shizune using quotation marks instead of square brackets, which generally means he's speaking out loud and allowing to Misha to translate. And Misha is present during the entire scene, so there's no reason to think things are working any differently than normal.

Quotation marks are used when he says "I love you", which is honestly really weird. You'd think if Hisao wanted to express such a personal sentiment to Shizune, he would sign it directly instead of depending on Misha to translate. You do have to assume that Misha did translate it, though, because immediately after the statement, Hisao thinks "I pause, wondering if she'll look at me, confused, and ask why I'd say it out of the blue. She doesn't". I think it would be inexplicable for Hisao to expect such a reaction from Shizune if he knew Shizune hadn't gotten the message, and it would be similarly inexplicable for Misha to choose not to translate the message without Hisao specifically noting that refusal. Perhaps the only explanation is that Shizune was looking away from Hisao and towards Misha at the moment (note how Hisao expects her to turn and look at him, which means she was not looking at him in the first place), so Hisao decided to use Misha as a translator instead of signing directly because he didn't want to have to grab Shizune's physical attention beforehand.

Other considerations: Misha was within earshot, so even if Hisao was intending to say "I love you" as a more personal confession than as a message to Shizune, there's no way he could expect Misha not to translate it. Also, after saying "I love you", he continues conversing with Shizune ("Do they do that reunion thing here?") and she is clearly able to understand him, since she responds.

In the end, it's probably just one of those moments in Shizune's route that are just not written very well.

[ShadeHaven]

A good poll would be "Hisao vs Shizune: Which do you hate more?" I personally hate neither, but I believe it would hold some interesting results.

And while I can maybe understand the hate for Hisao, Shizune just seem utterly misunderstood.

[Guest Poster]

I think both tend to be misunderstood, just for different reasons.

[Fretless]

I think both tend to be misunderstood, just for different reasons.

This. Hisao gets hate because when something bad happens, even if the girl he's with is at just as much fault as Hisao is, people tend to ignore the girl's involvement in the problem and blame Hisao for everything. This is especially common during Hanako's path.
As for Shizune, she tends to get hate for the same reasons that her fans, for what little there are, find her endearing. Her playful nature and being the leader type are either endearing or annoying to the reader. It seems that annoying is the general opinion, though.

Hisao's hatred is really undeserved in my opinion. He doesn't do anything really underhanded or bad, and even when he does screw up, he's always well meaning and thinking of others. I think the problem is that while he doesn't really do anything bad, he doesn't do anything to make us like him, either. He's just a nice guy in high school. And because the heroines get so much love, anything bad that happens is automatically blamed on Hisao, not on the girls for whatever they did to make the problem happen or make it worse, or on the player for guiding Hisao into making the dumb choices.
For my opinion on Shizune, I don't hate her. I didn't really hate her playfulness, and she does certainly do some cute things, like the whole thing with the touching of hands. My problem is that compared to the other girls, I found her rather...boring. I actually found myself being more interested in Hisao during her arc, and he's Average McBrownHair. Not to mention that I thought Misha's character was done so well and I related to Misha so much that she just stole the show.

[ShadeHaven]

I think both tend to be misunderstood, just for different reasons.

This. Hisao gets hate because when something bad happens, even if the girl he's with is at just as much fault as Hisao is, people tend to ignore the girl's involvement in the problem and blame Hisao for everything. This is especially common during Hanako's path.
As for Shizune, she tends to get hate for the same reasons that her fans, for what little there are, find her endearing. Her playful nature and being the leader type are either endearing or annoying to the reader. It seems that annoying is the general opinion, though.

Hisao's hatred is really undeserved in my opinion. He doesn't do anything really underhanded or bad, and even when he does screw up, he's always well meaning and thinking of others. I think the problem is that while he doesn't really do anything bad, he doesn't do anything to make us like him, either. He's just a nice guy in high school. And because the heroines get so much love, anything bad that happens is automatically blamed on Hisao, not on the girls for whatever they did to make the problem happen or make it worse, or on the player for guiding Hisao into making the dumb choices.
For my opinion on Shizune, I don't hate her. I didn't really hate her playfulness, and she does certainly do some cute things, like the whole thing with the touching of hands. My problem is that compared to the other girls, I found her rather...boring. I actually found myself being more interested in Hisao during her arc, and he's Average McBrownHair. Not to mention that I thought Misha's character was done so well and I related to Misha so much that she just stole the show.

This pretty much sums up how I personally feel about each of these characters. Even your point about Shizune being boring. After the first playthrough I thought I just hadn't payed enough attention, but when I played through her arc a second time, nothing changed. It seems somewhat empty, but Misha filled the voids pretty nicely.