Would love to see a KS 2 someday

A forum for general discussion of the game: Open to all punters
yukinara
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:41 am

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by yukinara » Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:55 pm

there is nothing sexist about it. This is a bishojo game, the girl already had their share of bishonen game

Nekken

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Nekken » Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm

Merlyn_LeRoy wrote:Same here. How about a female protagonist and male suitors?
As the whole game, I'd say this probably isn't a good idea (then again, I'm not sure a sequel is a good idea at all). But being able to choose a male or female protagonist, with two sets of suitors (some of whom might overlap between both protagonists) could be interesting. It would, however, send the number of paths through the roof.

Nekken

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Nekken » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:06 am

I've got to say, I'm really not sure that a sequel to this game is a good idea. The story is perfectly capable of standing on its own, but more than that, it's important to realize that this is a concept that could very easily have turned out as something truly horrendous. It's a testament to the dev team's determination to create something tasteful and sensitive (out of an original sketch that was, to be blunt, neither) that the game hasn't caused more controversy than it has. But that team is gone now, and this game has only been out for a week: we're all fired up from the game's release, and that kind of enthusiasm is infamous for its ability to trump sense. The original dev team didn't have that disadvantage.

Give it six months, and come back from a fresh perspective. If you still think you can see this through, and you're ready to do the kind of homework required to actually execute this as well as the first game did, then maybe it's time to consider doing something like this. Right now is too soon. This is the kind of thing that needs to be approached with a cool head, and none of us on these forums can be said to have that right now. My head isn't cool either; for all that I'm saying it's a bad idea to go rushing into a sequel dev effort like this, I still want to be part of it if it starts (my skills lie in writing, both prose and Python). But seriously: I don't think now is the time.

viduuskamen
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2012 12:47 am
Location: USA

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by viduuskamen » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:13 am

I am not sure if this has been mentioned already, but I wonder if the game would have had the same impact if the casts' genders were all reversed with minimal, if any change in the script.

I think a lot of the notions and expectations would be challenged, but I haven't been quite able to fully think about it in my head.
I'm still recovering from the original game...
"It's kinda funny, I've played a bunch of VN's and for the first time I'm feeling apprehensive about going down another path. I'm thinking weird crap like how will Hanako ever be happy if someones not there for her.......If Hanako's writer reads this I want you to know that I thank you for giving me this wonderful treasure."
-Rykn

[I feel like a giant jerk for completing the game.]

User avatar
NomadicElectron
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:26 pm

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by NomadicElectron » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:37 am

Nekken wrote:I've got to say, I'm really not sure that a sequel to this game is a good idea. The story is perfectly capable of standing on its own, but more than that, it's important to realize that this is a concept that could very easily have turned out as something truly horrendous. It's a testament to the dev team's determination to create something tasteful and sensitive (out of an original sketch that was, to be blunt, neither) that the game hasn't caused more controversy than it has. But that team is gone now, and this game has only been out for a week: we're all fired up from the game's release, and that kind of enthusiasm is infamous for its ability to trump sense. The original dev team didn't have that disadvantage.

Give it six months, and come back from a fresh perspective. If you still think you can see this through, and you're ready to do the kind of homework required to actually execute this as well as the first game did, then maybe it's time to consider doing something like this. Right now is too soon. This is the kind of thing that needs to be approached with a cool head, and none of us on these forums can be said to have that right now. My head isn't cool either; for all that I'm saying it's a bad idea to go rushing into a sequel dev effort like this, I still want to be part of it if it starts (my skills lie in writing, both prose and Python). But seriously: I don't think now is the time.
This. If in six months we all still have the passion and the drive to make this happen and feel you can put out a product of similarly high quality then I'd be happy to be on board, too (writer/renpy scripting) because I think we'd be in the right mindset. Right now though, I think it's so early we're acting on our I WANT MORE KS kneejerk emotions and not being too grounded in reality. It's natural to want more of something great, but there's a danger to that too. Three words: Star Wars Prequels.
Hanako>Lilly>Emi>Rin>Shizune

Lolz2day

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Lolz2day » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:44 am

True, but within 6 months we'll all be caught within the flow of life and realistically, we'll forget about this post and the idea of a KS 2. However, it's true that we might all be "high" on KS fever, so wait within a more realistic period before getting into the idea.

(Still it would be cool for a KS 2 made by the fans of the 4LS KS)

User avatar
NomadicElectron
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:26 pm

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by NomadicElectron » Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:02 am

Lolz2day wrote:True, but within 6 months we'll all be caught within the flow of life and realistically, we'll forget about this post and the idea of a KS 2. However, it's true that we might all be "high" on KS fever, so wait within a more realistic period before getting into the idea.

(Still it would be cool for a KS 2 made by the fans of the 4LS KS)
Exactly, if we'd all forget in six months then we probably don't have the drive to put the same kind of work 4LS put into it and we'd just end up pumping out a sub-par product that would grossly pale in comparison. Definitely agree that a KS 2 would be cool if done right, and there's plenty of very capable people on these forums, of that I'm sure - but it would be a huge commitment and would take some incredible writing to keep from seeming like a superficial ripoff. Let ideas flow, characters grow and plotlines percolate for the future - but for right now I say let's just enjoy what we have.
Hanako>Lilly>Emi>Rin>Shizune

QbertEnhanced
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:58 pm

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by QbertEnhanced » Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:09 am

I'll be back in a month, just long enough to let some realism sink into you folks, if anyone's feeling up to the task I'd love to throw my hat in. I'm a programmer by trade and if we can get a group together I'd love to see some of your ideas in extending this concept. I honestly think that there are more stories worth telling, whether with old characters or new, and the amazing out of the blue job this team has done has made me realize that it truly can be done. So if any of you also feel that you have a story to tell, just make a mental note to check back here. If interest seems high enough we can get started with a forum, IRC and such for further discussion.
Thank you for reading.

Lolz2day

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Lolz2day » Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:25 am

RIght, if we actually want this "KS 2" to work we need ideas. It doesn't matter if the idea seems useless or random; the purpose of these ideas is to revise and re-edit to get a working, concrete idea. Generally, we want to start with characters (what's a story without characters); this can either be OCs or based of a drawing or sketch (preferably the latter as it seems more KS-like). Then we need to create some form of a core group or write some outline on possible story lines (whichever can generate interest). Then we'll work from there

(Not a bad idea right?)

User avatar
Merlyn_LeRoy
Posts: 556
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:35 pm
Location: Minnesota
Contact:

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Merlyn_LeRoy » Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:43 am

GREENSBORO, N.C. (AP) — Ex-presidential candidate John Edwards has a serious heart condition that will require a medical procedure next month and his illness limits his travel including for an upcoming court case over possible campaign violations, his doctor told a judge, who delayed the trial.
Let's see, you're a former US Senator with a serious heart condition on trial for campaign violations...

User avatar
Rykthrall
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:52 pm

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Rykthrall » Sat Jan 14, 2012 2:23 am

Merlyn_LeRoy wrote:
GREENSBORO, N.C. (AP) — Ex-presidential candidate John Edwards has a serious heart condition that will require a medical procedure next month and his illness limits his travel including for an upcoming court case over possible campaign violations, his doctor told a judge, who delayed the trial.
Let's see, you're a former US Senator with a serious heart condition on trial for campaign violations...
I think we have a winner.

QbertEnhanced
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:58 pm

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by QbertEnhanced » Sat Jan 14, 2012 2:29 am

There's 2 basic paths I think are reasonable. Expand the school and/or concept, new characters, new OC, new story lines and such. Or a full fledged expansion of the existing game. I personally lean towards the former, but I'm interested in which idea has greater appeal to the people here, without the people we're nothing.
New Story Pros: Possibility of bringing in all new authors to really give a different experience than the existing game. Fresh start, not so strongly compared to KS which gives the project room to breathe, won't have people saying <insert their favorite character here> wouldn't have done such and such.
New Story Cons: I know a lot of the people here are just wanting some expansion of their favorite characters lives, which is of course understandable. Without providing that, we may lose a lot of interest.
Expansion Pros: Character development is a non-issue, storyline being the main focus, may be easier to get people personally interested in the story, possibility of communication with original authors to get their ideas of where things could have gone.
Expansion Cons: Could be boring, derivative, strong possibility of adding absolutely nothing. Plus, any writers you'd find are most likely just looking to make the ending they thought up in their head official. Need to get original writers on board, without the original writer so much of the original character conception would be lost that it'd be more or less worthless.

Benkei
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 12:14 am

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Benkei » Sat Jan 14, 2012 3:07 am

Would you guys even have permission to write a KS 2 without the KS 1 devs' unanimous permission? :?: I'm not so sure you would. I don't know all the details regarding the Ren'Py license, but I'm pretty sure that the proverbial dotted line that 4LS signed on when they agreed to use the Ren'Py engine did not forbid them the right to reserve intellectual property over the fictional characters, fictional locations, et cetera created by them in this work. Now granted, many of them are probably very, very liberal when it comes to ideas like intellectual property and copyright, but still: I think it's awfully presumptuous of the fanbase to just assume that they can make a game with Hisao or Hanako or Kenji or anyone else of the KS gang just because they want to. :? If even all of 4LS but one member say "yes, you may" but that one member says "no, you may not," then I'm not sure you'd have the right. Would you?

If, on the other hand, the devs have made it perfectly clear, "Go ahead and use our characters and settings. We don't care. In fact, we'd like it if you did," then never mind.

To be perfectly honest, I think that if fans are really that motivated by KS to make their own visual novels, that is fantastic. However, instead of doing something derivative (like a KS sequel or a KS spin-off), it would be better to try and make a unique game with its own characters, settings, and plot. Taking somebody else's vision and adopting it for your own ... I dunno, but to me, that seems to be the quick-and-easy approach to art. And true art is rarely quickly or easily gained. Just look at the story of Katawa Shoujo. Five years in the making with literal blood, sweat, and tears paving the way.

TheGrimAngel
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:30 pm
Location: Hachiouji, Japan

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by TheGrimAngel » Sat Jan 14, 2012 6:56 am

Benkei wrote:Would you guys even have permission to write a KS 2 without the KS 1 devs' unanimous permission? :?: I'm not so sure you would. I don't know all the details regarding the Ren'Py license, but I'm pretty sure that the proverbial dotted line that 4LS signed on when they agreed to use the Ren'Py engine did not forbid them the right to reserve intellectual property over the fictional characters, fictional locations, et cetera created by them in this work. Now granted, many of them are probably very, very liberal when it comes to ideas like intellectual property and copyright, but still: I think it's awfully presumptuous of the fanbase to just assume that they can make a game with Hisao or Hanako or Kenji or anyone else of the KS gang just because they want to. :? If even all of 4LS but one member say "yes, you may" but that one member says "no, you may not," then I'm not sure you'd have the right. Would you?

If, on the other hand, the devs have made it perfectly clear, "Go ahead and use our characters and settings. We don't care. In fact, we'd like it if you did," then never mind.

To be perfectly honest, I think that if fans are really that motivated by KS to make their own visual novels, that is fantastic. However, instead of doing something derivative (like a KS sequel or a KS spin-off), it would be better to try and make a unique game with its own characters, settings, and plot. Taking somebody else's vision and adopting it for your own ... I dunno, but to me, that seems to be the quick-and-easy approach to art. And true art is rarely quickly or easily gained. Just look at the story of Katawa Shoujo. Five years in the making with literal blood, sweat, and tears paving the way.
Thats a good point, but I don't see why they wouldn't allow it if they felt the concept that was thought up was good enough, it is always worth a try. A couple of us have already started discussing ideas for a fan made KS2. If anyone is interested give me a PM and I'll show you what we've gotten so far in the way fo the 5 girls, concept sketch, etc.
Why pick a favorite character? Each of the story was beautiful and touching in its own unique way.

User avatar
Suriko
Lilly Writer, Hanako Co-Writer, Producer
Posts: 1508
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:10 am
Location: Australia

Re: Would love to see a KS 2 someday

Post by Suriko » Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:18 am

I hate to come down on a thread like this. From this line you can probably guess what's coming.

The KS license prohibits any derivative work to Katawa Shoujo being produced. We waive this provision at our discretion, and have absolutely no problem doing so for fanfics, fanart, music, whatever. It's really cool to see people making that kind of stuff for KS, and it's nice to see how other people see the game, its themes, and its characters, and how they communicate that through their art/writing/music.

That said, a line has to be drawn somewhere. We've discussed this internally and had to make some hard decisions to try and be both unambiguous, but also not come off as overprotective. This line is drawn at visual novels. We won't and never will give permission to produce a sequel (or prequel) to Katawa Shoujo, because in our minds KS was this single project and it's our preference to keep it that way. Besides this, using the Katawa Shoujo title for any visual novel (eg. "Katawa Shoujo 2") would be way out as well.

Another part of this is the fact that if anyone can harness the talent to make a visual novel, it would be really disappointing to see it used on retreading the same ground that Katawa Shoujo did. Think you have the resources to pull off the creation of a visual novel? Great! That's awesome, because you have the means to use a pretty cool medium to tell an entirely new story. Make the most of it, and we'll be pleased as punch to have inspired you to create something new.

Post Reply