Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

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Caesius
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Caesius » Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:35 am

Fronzel wrote:
Caesius wrote:...many players get "railroaded" into Emi's route in Act 1, which I remember Aura mentioning was a deliberate design.
Where did Aura say that? I'd like to see elaboration on this. What's it for?
http://ks.renai.us/viewtopic.php?p=17338#p17338

Seems I misremembered and he didn't specifically say that they were railroading people into Emi's route, but that's pretty much the implication.

Also I hate digging for posts from like 2 years ago and I hope I don't keep saying things that I barely remember other people saying only to have to go mining for the exact quote when someone inquires about it.


Edit:
Caesius wrote:I guess what Aura wanted to do with the "Go for it" choice was have the player realize Hisao's limits, but still know that Hisao wouldn't be comfortable letting just anyone know his condition -- so Emi's path will definitely put a lot of emphasis on Hisao's condition, whereas if there's any focus on Emi's "disability" at all it will probably only deal with the history and how she managed to come to terms with it. Shizune's path, on the other hand, is for the "stubborn" Hisao, who refuses to acknowledge his condition. Then there's the Kenji bad end, for the "angry" Hisao who is in fact so devastated by his condition that it causes him to push everyone away, leaving him alone and broken (literally).
I almost don't remember making this point, but it's interesting to go back and see firsthand the assumption I made regarding Emi and how I was right and wrong at the same time. (I was mostly just wrong though.)
Last edited by Caesius on Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by whiteflags » Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:46 am

That's the price you pay for reading this forum for so long though.

Me, I kind of feel bad because taking stock of everyone's emotional reaction to the stories makes me feel very inadequate. To the point where I wonder if some are exaggerating because to be honest, Lilly's route made me misty eyed and that has been all so far. Emi's route, having just finished it completely, was the most fun to read. To say nothing about the relationship, I appreciate her casual attitude towards sex and I really wanted to see what kind of body constant track meets forged. I was not disappointed.
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Caesius
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Caesius » Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:50 am

whiteflags wrote:Me, I kind of feel bad because taking stock of everyone's emotional reaction to the stories makes me feel very inadequate.
Well, your emotional reaction is directly proportionate to how "into it" you are. So maybe you didn't take the story seriously enough!
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by RakkaKaze » Thu Jan 12, 2012 6:41 am

As someone near the beginning of this thread also stated, I hopped into Katawa Shoujo simply picking what I would pick on the spot with little thought and ended up down the emi-good route.

I enjoyed it the whole way through, however my main issue here was... (especially looking at a flow chart to make sure I go a different route) the second I say yes to nurse and start her arc it's like all the other major characters aside from nurse/teacher/kenji have evaporated and are never seen again. (Aside from some... comical rin appearances)

Going a good way into the hanako route, I've still seen almost all the characters BUT emi... I'd assume this would be the other way around seeing as one is outgoing and the other... isn't... in any way, shape, or form.

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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Lloonnee2 » Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:05 am

Was introduced to this game by my friend, and I thought (after a lot of convincing), why not give it a go?

I did some reading on tvtropes and Wikipedia, and saw the 5 characters. Immediately set my mind on Emi, since I've always liked twintails for some reason o.o

------------------What was going on in my mind on first play of it.-----------------------

I don't really care about the Student Council/Body or whatever, but that pink hair girl either had too much sugar/coffee or is hyperactive >.>
Yes, I think I can find my way around, thank you very much.
Mute and dumb girl, well....seems okay.
Yup, gotta go. Later...
Ooh the girl with scars. Interesting, but not my type.
Nurse? Well okay...
More pink hair and dumb/mute girl. Shoo ~_~
Blind girl. Wut? O.o, you seem pretty normal.
Oh it's the scarred girl. H-bye!
Yes, she WAS cute. Who the hell are you anyway...? >:(
Why are so many attractive girls in this school? Gee, I wonder if it's something to do with....nevermind =P
Off with you, Kenji-guy!
Wow first time I see pink hair, scarred and dumb/mute girl in the same scene.
That was quick. I guess I'd better read by book.
*Emi runs into my character*
..Wait, are those her shorts? She doesn't look like she's wearing any...
Oh gee...dem legs. =/
Oh hey....er...."Twintails girl"! Finally I get to meet you >.>
You wouldn't believe how much I had to "space" my way to get to this scene, y'know?
Wait, did you just ram me in the chest? My heart seems to be...
No, no, I'm okay...
Wait, it's the pink hair girl and the dumb/mute girl again. Where the heck did you guys come from O_O
Look guys, she only hit me with the force of a train, it's not like she killed me or something. Well nearly...
*Emi runs off*
WAIT HOLD ON A SEC.....damn....
Blah blah blah, more text. The teacher looks o.O
Quirky intro to girl w/o arms. I see. No thank you though. I want to talk to Emi! D:
....Did you just space out while I was talking? O_O
So you paint. Nice.
Hey Emi! Nice to meet you for a...run...? I don't remember signing up for this, but what the heck.
...You're pretty cute with your sense of humor.
Yea, I'm in bad shape =/ But it's encouraging though :D
Oh er bye.
THE HELL?!?! I CAN'T EVEN SHOWER IN PEACE? KENJI WHAT IN THE .... are you doing here clad in only a leaf? -_-
Y'know what, shoo! I want to shower without someone looking at me >:(

Yada yada yada blind girl okay...um bye....wait, it's the duo again. The pink hair girl and the deaf/mute one. Gee..
Oh it's some arguement.
Keep me out of your plans, whatever they are o_o
Well sorry...Shizune? That's your name? Look, I don't really have time for this, but...
Oh gee you two again and the poor scarred girl.
She went off! Wait what?
Uh yea, nice.....painting.....
Night already?
Hey Emi! Well, let's go! ^_^
Look, I'm serious about this running thing. I'm beat you >:D
BAN....KAA~III !!!!
What *pant* the hell, *pant, you can still *pant* run? *pant*
I'm gonna win youuuu!
...Shit.
This can't be.
Well seeing as I'm about to die, you could get the Nurse i guess.
Oh wait, false alarm. Thanks though :D
Look, I'm really alrig-Nurse? What th-
You're cute when you're flustered.
Look Nurse, it's totally my fault that she started running faster. I just didn't want to lose, y'know?
Yea we're both stupid. Derp.
Aw look Emi, it's okay...
Lunch with you? Well okay!
Roof? Isn't that a dangerous place?
Cya! :D
Sleep ~_~
Blahblahblahblahblah

Hey it's Emi!
And er...Rin, right? Hi, Rin.
Emi: "(talking about how running gives her an appetite that allows her to go through lunch and also maintain her girlish figure)
Rin: "What happens if you lose it? Would you become a man?
LOL RIN :D
Like what? Well, for starters....nevermind...
Poor Rin..
Thousand watt grin. Certainly looks like it ^__^
DEM PUPPY DOG EYES. OKAY I ACCEPT I ACCEPT!

Library wut? Spacebar time.
Le teacher. Cya.
Hanako! Oh my...and it's Lilly, right? Well...bye.
What am I doing? Well I kinda go stunned as you leaned in.
Help you and Rin? I guess...
What's all this about Prussian Blue?
Look, I am a tad out of shape, but...
What's what?
Joining you in what?
Running partners? Sure :D
You look like you've been planning this a lot.....more than just a little. Wut.
Well I'd be happy to be your partner, but I need a token resistance!
No, no I don't actually. Look, it was just a bit of...
DEM PUPPY DOG EYES!
Well given what you said about pouting and conscience, I didn't really have much of a choice.
Dietary plan....wut?

Kenji. Get. out. of. my. way. Seriously O_O, you're making me a bit scared. Not by the girls, by You!

Food!
I'm just getting my...lunch?
Look ,it's breakfast then.
No! Not at all!
See, it's lunch!
Brunch, then?
Well it IS a healthy brunch!
MY FOOD!
My heart? Well I don't know, it could stand you running smack into me like a bullet train, I guess it can handle a bit of oil...
Damn, you got me cornered. >_<
Never! I must get out of this trap!
....*whimper*
Yea, I almost died!
...That near death nearly killed me! I would count that as a legitimate reason to skip exercising...but not such food :D
Wait what?
Well I didn't really....alright.
Yea, why do you suddenly care about me so much o.o
Gee thanks. Although I do count you as one friend I guess.
Crazy little running girl wants to make me healthy. Couldn't say it better myself.
My chance to escape!
Wait what?
Company? I'm not that hard up for compan-
Seriously, I didn't think about that, but now that you mention it.
Heck no! >:D
*Glare*
Maybe a bit..?
*Glare*
*whimper*
Okay, a lot! =_=
Stick with me? I don't know about...
Ah well. I guess it would be interesting to be following some little girl.
Mural? Okay..
Die on you? Heck yes >:D
Well when you put it that way...I'm fine :)
Well hi Rin.
Yea, I nearly gave myself a heart attack. Wait, is that even possible? Oh yea the food.
blah blah blah
O_Okay... what painting is that of again?
Picnic eh. Should've gone for fried food, but with Emi around...no chance >.<
Morning runs? Yea.
Angry? That's not pouting right?
Rin: Unless there's some kind of freak accdident and your alarm clock shorts out. That might be a random act of God."
Emi: Well don't cause any random acts of God then.
LOL EMI
Yea, I might just have a chance. One last meal of fried goodness!
*Lies*
....please don't see through it......please...
No, no, I'm really too full.
Damn....that sucks. Did she pretend to fall for it?
Runnnnnnnnnn.......

Act 1 ended? Woots! I think I got Emi!

--------------------------Act 2 to come soon :D------------------------------------------------
My KS tribute video to Emi: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MO3ETgqrV0c

Prospektor

Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Prospektor » Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:34 am

Caesius wrote:Third and most obvious is the way that many players get "railroaded" into Emi's route in Act 1, which I remember Aura mentioning was a deliberate design. Many players responded negatively to that fact when Act 1 came out because they wanted to get on a different girl's route and felt that they were being punished (or at least, not rewarded) for not making "better" choices in Act 1.
Well, I don't know if that was a deliberate attempt, I certainly can and will not question the intention of the developers. But the way it plays out in the final product (I've never played the demo) doesn't railroad at all IMO. It is a natural decision based on your choices.
Remember you only get to Emi if you answer the nurse "yes" when he asks if you will exercise. Rin for example would be the first person to answer "maybe" (with a shrug, of course), and Lilly and Hanako are the types that rather shy away from too much strain (Lilly quitting the student council when it resulted in confrontation, Hanako leaving class on a regular basis). But even if you answer "yes": For the same reasons these three also wouldn't fit the "Go for it!" choice when running with Emi.
This only leaves Emi and Shizune, whose personalities are more aggressive and competitive than the other's. And if you previously got on the student council path, you stay there and have no chance to get on the Emi path.
So I wouldn't say you get "railroaded" at all, it is a rather logical choice based on your decisions which pairs you with the girl that fits them the most. If your desire to impress a girl is so strong that you disregard your health issues, you cannot complain when you end up with her. :)

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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Caesius » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:13 pm

Lloonnee2 wrote:--------------------------Act 2 to come soon :D------------------------------------------------
I skimmed through the post thinking that you were writing down your thoughts for the entire route and then hit this bombshell.

Please don't do this for each act.
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Xuan » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:27 pm

I have somewhat expected some pretty deep stuff on Emi's virginity after seeing a thread titled as such around, but the actual story was very tame on that subject. Hmm.

Emi can be considered as my least favorite character because of her sprite, and Act 1. Her story has been the blandest out of all four (Hanako a close contender, playing chess in the tea room during a festival -_-" but that's been removed in the final product) in Act 1, and her aggressiveness isn't exactly... welcomed for first impressions. It kind of worsened when I played through Rin's route, seeing her track CGs.

But after going through her actual story, there was no doubt that it deserves its praises and stood on par, if not higher in quality as compared to the other routes.

There were only two flaws I have seen in this story.

One, after choosing to talk to Meiko, got found out by Emi, and at the rooftop after Rin left they talked to each other, Emi's supposedly still defensive reaction suddenly turn 'I'msosorryIloveyouIloveyoudon'tleaveme' was a little awkward and weird. If you choose to 'Go After Her' instead of talking to Meiko the scenes later reveal a CG, so I supposed the writer was kind of lazy or blocked to write this scene? But talking to Meiko was supposedly the 'right' choice to make, so...

The second would be more of a scene placement problem. After their final sex they went to sleep, and the story should've went to credits there and then. The little talk after they woke up should've been made an epilogue, short as it is, but also much more fitting and satisfying.

All in all, Emi's route is a much, much better reference to real life romance (Yes, I don't care how awesome your partner is, at some point and subject he/she WILL push you away similar to Emi's actions, if not milder or wilder) and I believe that a lot of people could use some tips from this story. At least my experience for this route turned out more educational than I thought. Kinda funny.
" It would be hard to believe I was nearly killed by a love confession."

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Caesius
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Caesius » Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:02 pm

Xuan wrote:One, after choosing to talk to Meiko, got found out by Emi, and at the rooftop after Rin left they talked to each other, Emi's supposedly still defensive reaction suddenly turn 'I'msosorryIloveyouIloveyoudon'tleaveme' was a little awkward and weird.
I think it's fine that she had that sudden turnaround, since no matter how determined she was to keep up the facade she could only take so much before it shattered. When that happened she simply couldn't keep it all bottled up anymore, so it's fine that that singular moment turned out a little awkward -- I mean, what do you expect?

However I do feel that the scene in and of itself was awkward, but only because I think the sprite choice didn't feel "serious" enough for that moment. A CG might have worked better, although if I remember correctly the actual hug was only for that one screen of dialogue so it wouldn't have been long enough to warrant a CG. At the same time, I don't think A22 could have written the scene to have a longer "hug moment" in an attempt to justify having one. So really the awkwardness is a result of the limited resources delta had at his disposal.
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Xuan
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Xuan » Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:18 pm

What I meant was for that scene, the sudden turnaround wasn't written well enough, or long enough to be precise. It's like saying, 'I like bread' and the next line 'I hate bread', it doesn't make good enough sense; people're expecting some sort of explanation to the statements.
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by bradpara » Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:43 pm

Having played this route, I have to say that when I went into this, I wasn't the biggest Emi fan, her Act 1 is by far the most, meh. However, she after playing ths route I am rethinking myself.

This is the second route that I have played, (Shizune was my first) and I have to say that while I shall defend the storytelling of the latter. I enjoyed the more conventional love story of this arc. Though the anal sex scene was abit hard to watch. I kinda guessed that Emi's father died in the same accident that took her legs rather early one but that did not make the cemetary scene any less powerful for.

Also the I did like the feel of the good end and after having played Shizune's path first it made for a good contrast since part of this path was about Emi and Hisao learing to live for the moment, while Shizune's end was very much about that fact that everyone had a solid idea of their futures

Actually the biggest suprise was just how promienent Mutou was in ths Arc epsecially since the advice he gives Hisao about how a Scientist views the world is so important to Hisao in figuring out to resolve his issues with Emi.

Note to self: Try to find my copy of "A Breif History of Time" for Mutou cosplay.

Loved it, that is all I have to say

2 down 3 to go, Next Stop Rin
Shizune=Hanako>Lilly>Emi=Rin
Family Game Night A Shizune After Story Fic
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by alabaster » Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:57 pm

bradpara wrote:2 down 3 to go, Next Stop Rin
Just a suggestion: take a short break from KS, or at least clear your head before jumping into Rin's path. It's very different from the rest and honestly I didn't appreciate it that much the first time. I took it a bit too fast and was coming off the much more conventional love stories of Emi and Lilly, so I don't think I was in the right head space for Rin. Just some friendly advice.

Prospektor

Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by Prospektor » Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:15 pm

Xuan wrote:What I meant was for that scene, the sudden turnaround wasn't written well enough, or long enough to be precise. It's like saying, 'I like bread' and the next line 'I hate bread', it doesn't make good enough sense; people're expecting some sort of explanation to the statements.
Well, I guess there's always kind of a personal viewpoint involved, but I for one was satisfied with how it played out. You could see that at first she wants to keep a friendly distance and just ignore what happened in her house, but Hisao brings it up. The friendlier and more emotional Hisao gets, the closer to her, the harder she strikes back because she doesn't want to show weakness or emotion that could be interpreted as weakness. I mean it's pretty obvious she doesn't hate him, she only hates the thought of being seen as someone who needs help. But in the end, since Hisao has figured her out, he can address exactly that:
"So I'm not going to help you because I think you need rescuing. I don't want to be a knight rescuing the damsel in distress, but even knights helped each other out, you know. I want to help you, even though I know you can do it on your own."
This hit right home, and then she asks why and he says he loves her, and that's that. So, I don't see it as a "mood change" out of the blue. But with an emotional thing like KS everybody is set to have an individual response to it.
Xuan wrote:The second would be more of a scene placement problem. After their final sex they went to sleep, and the story should've went to credits there and then. The little talk after they woke up should've been made an epilogue, short as it is, but also much more fitting and satisfying.
You're right, the very last episode could have been an epilogue, I kinda looked at it that way, too. I don't know why (only) Lilly has an epilogue after the credits, but from what I understood, a few people missed it due to not using the "skip" button or waiting for the credits to end, so maybe, in the time of shorter and shorter attention spans, it's an understandable decision to put it before the credits? It's hard to tell, in a book you can just title it "epilogue" and everybody knows where to place it, but I can see the trouble when doing it in a VN, which plays out more like a movie.

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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by imperial.standard » Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:24 pm

Okay, I know I may get flak for mentioning this but I personally think Emi is the most shallow character of the five girls we get to choose (even Misha has a more complex character dilemma). Shizune as well but I get the feeling this is because once we chose her path, we aren't treated to many options until the end (maybe to emphasize the "leading" character of Shizune?)

Emi's characterization of an emotionally scarred person hiding behind a cheery facade doesn't strike me to be anything novel. Although the presentation itself is superb and I enjoyed her route far better than Rin's.
alabaster wrote:
bradpara wrote:2 down 3 to go, Next Stop Rin
Just a suggestion: take a short break from KS, or at least clear your head before jumping into Rin's path. It's very different from the rest and honestly I didn't appreciate it that much the first time.
How true. Her route is the most complex and dark. I suspect she suffers something else (mentally) other than just missing upper limbs...
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Re: Discussion - Emi Route (*Spoilers* Warning)

Post by alabaster » Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:29 pm

Prospektor wrote:You're right, the very last episode could have been an epilogue, I kinda looked at it that way, too. I don't know why (only) Lilly has an epilogue after the credits, but from what I understood, a few people missed it due to not using the "skip" button or waiting for the credits to end, so maybe, in the time of shorter and shorter attention spans, it's an understandable decision to put it before the credits? It's hard to tell, in a book you can just title it "epilogue" and everybody knows where to place it, but I can see the trouble when doing it in a VN, which plays out more like a movie.
It's weird to me that people don't watch the credits. I always watch the credits of something I've enjoyed. I guess I think of it as sign of respect to the people who created it. I just feel wrong skipping over that part.

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