The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

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Zerix

Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Zerix » Fri Jan 06, 2012 5:33 pm

I actually believe it makes the most sense to have Hisao not be able to agree with Lilly without going into the city. Without the city excursion, there really isn't enough evidence for Hanako's possible independence for Hisao to realistically agree with Lilly, even if he wanted to. If you notice, without going into the city, the option you choose may not change the overall outcome, but his mental response does change ever so slightly. At least I think it does, unless I'm crazy.

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Grayfox
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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Grayfox » Fri Jan 06, 2012 5:45 pm

tyren wrote:
Exterminator 2000 wrote:
Walpurgisnacht wrote:I didn't know there was a bad or neutral ending, either way I don't want to know what they are lol. I just decided to be myself and I got the good ending :D
Well, they're actually not that 'bad', especially compared to other VNs.
I dunno, I consider Hanako's bad ending to be pretty damn bad. Not only does she kick Hisao out of the room, she says that she despises both Lilly and Hisao because rather than treating her like a person, they feel like she's a thing that should be protected, and to top it all off, it's implied that she very possibly went on to commit suicide.
clyspe wrote:Disclaimer: Hanako path was my favorite by far and she's the second best character in the game. That said, the artists made a hugely fatal flaw. Most of the high quality drawings that accompany a major moment (dunno what to call them exactly) always show Hanako at profile, with her scars hidden. WAT. Something that made the path so beautiful to me was that he realized those scars are part of what makes her beautiful, that and the scars' implications.
I'm not sure what other art your talking about, but I know one big one people mention was The final CG, where she kisses Hisao right outside of that bakery. And that didn't come across to me as them hiding her scars as much as there is a realization that hit me: That the side that has the scars, that isn't showing to the player, is showing to bystanders. Who are watching.

And she doesn't care. And to me, that was way more awesome than them changing the angel so that her scars would be the visible side, especially if it meant that we mightn ot see the bystanders in the shot.


EDIT: My bad, fucked the code up a bit. fix'd now.
Last edited by Grayfox on Fri Jan 06, 2012 5:59 pm, edited 3 times in total.
"We're not tools of the government, or anyone else. Fighting was the only thing... The only thing I was good at. But at least I always fought for what I believed in."
-Frank Jaegar

Completion Percentage: 100%

Paths Complete: Emi, Hanako, Lilly, Rin, Shizune

Current Path: Hanako (2nd Playthrough)

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tyren
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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by tyren » Fri Jan 06, 2012 5:55 pm

Zerix wrote:I actually believe it makes the most sense to have Hisao not be able to agree with Lilly without going into the city. Without the city excursion, there really isn't enough evidence for Hanako's possible independence for Hisao to realistically agree with Lilly, even if he wanted to. If you notice, without going into the city, the option you choose may not change the overall outcome, but his mental response does change ever so slightly. At least I think it does, unless I'm crazy.
I'm almost positive it doesn't. If it does, it's like one or two words. His narration/inner monologue is nearly identical either way, and I know for sure without checking that he still says flat-out that he can't agree with Lilly.

Anyway, it just rubs me the wrong way to present you with a choice and then railroad you onto the same path regardless of your choice, especially when the character's thoughts contradict the choice you actually made. Like I said, the neutral ending would have worked well enough as a difference - Hisao agrees with Lilly, but is still concerned, so he goes to see her anyway but is less overbearing about it.

Edit:
Grayfox wrote:I'm not sure what other art your talking about, but I know one big one people mention was The final CG, where she kisses Hisao right outside of that bakery. And that didn't come across to me as them hiding her scars as much as there is a realization that hit me: That the side that has the scars, that isn't showing to the player, is showing to bystanders. Who are watching.

And she doesn't care. And to me, that was way more awesome than them changing the angel so that her scars would be the visible side, especially if it meant that we mightn ot see the bystanders in the shot.
.........Damn, that is an excellent point. I was slightly annoyed by the hidden scars in that CG too (wasn't a big deal, but yeah) but that probably never would have occurred to me. That is an amazing way to look at that CG.

Zerix

Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Zerix » Fri Jan 06, 2012 5:59 pm

Actually, if you put it that way, it seems to me that it would actually work better to not give you any choice at all during the Lilly conversation if you chose not to go into the city. Since either way, Hisao cannot agree with Lilly, no choice should be given, because no choice IS given.

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tyren
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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by tyren » Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:06 pm

Zerix wrote:Actually, if you put it that way, it seems to me that it would actually work better to not give you any choice at all during the Lilly conversation if you chose not to go into the city. Since either way, Hisao cannot agree with Lilly, no choice should be given, because no choice IS given.
I was thinking that but I also think if they'd done that it needs to somehow be clear that you'd be given a choice there otherwise. Maybe one of the choices is greyed out? I don't know.

Anyway, without seeing the evidence with his own eyes, it's at least reasonable of him to trust the word of someone who's known Hanako longer, so having the choice there makes sense and I still think the neutral ending would have worked better. :P
Last edited by tyren on Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

rhfs
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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by rhfs » Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:09 pm

Has anyone else played Shiznue's route and seen the scene where Hanako and Shiznue play chess? I felt so bad for her after they switched to speed chess and she got destroyed. She didn't even get her ID!

It's interesting (though depressing, since she is my favorite) to see how she is portrayed without the help of Hisao.

Rawrbob

Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Rawrbob » Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:26 pm

At first I got the bad end, I was shocked and was quite sad D:. I got nutural end, and kept getting nutrual. I was liek WTF? Then i restarted the program and got the good ending. then I :D

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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Mirage_GSM » Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:40 pm

tyren wrote:I was thinking that but I also think if they'd done that it needs to somehow be clear that you'd be given a choice there otherwise. Maybe one of the choices is greyed out? I don't know.

Anyway, without seeing the evidence with his own eyes, it's at least reasonable of him to trust the word of someone who's known Hanako longer, so having the choice there makes sense and I still think the neutral ending would have worked better. :P
There are other choice points in KS where you only see the options that have been flagged by previous choices. An example would be Lunch Evolution Theory: If you blow of both Shizune and Hanako in the initial five choices you don't even see there is a choice here - you go straight to reading your book.
I think this is how this should have been handled here as well.
Emi > Misha > Hanako > Lilly > Rin > Shizune

My collected KS-Fan Fictions: Mirage's Myths
griffon8 wrote:Kosher, just because sex is your answer to everything doesn't mean that sex is the answer to everything.
Sore wa himitsu desu.

Walpurgisnacht

Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Walpurgisnacht » Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:52 pm

Mirage_GSM wrote:
tyren wrote:I was thinking that but I also think if they'd done that it needs to somehow be clear that you'd be given a choice there otherwise. Maybe one of the choices is greyed out? I don't know.

Anyway, without seeing the evidence with his own eyes, it's at least reasonable of him to trust the word of someone who's known Hanako longer, so having the choice there makes sense and I still think the neutral ending would have worked better. :P
There are other choice points in KS where you only see the options that have been flagged by previous choices. An example would be Lunch Evolution Theory: If you blow of both Shizune and Hanako in the initial five choices you don't even see there is a choice here - you go straight to reading your book.
I think this is how this should have been handled here as well.
Actually I don't think choice points really mattered, for some reason I jumped bewteen different routes in act 1. I was trying to get hanako's route, then I somehow switch to Rin's route (Had lunch with her and Emi on the roof) and went to town with Lily and Rin. Apparently the people you have lunch with on the rooftop determines which route you are on, but I doubt that. I think the point which determined whether I went on Hanako's route or not was when you get the choice to hang out in the library or not or something =/

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IBlameRoadSuess
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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by IBlameRoadSuess » Fri Jan 06, 2012 7:31 pm

Ubuyo wrote:
Rykn wrote:I't's kinda funny, I've played a bunch of VN's and for the first time I'm feeling apprehensive about going down another path. I'm thinking weird crap like how will Hanako ever be happy if someones not there for her....... If Hanako's writer reads this I want you to know that I thank you for giving me this wonderful treasure.
THIIIIIIIIS.
Fav Characters: Hanako > Lilly > Akira> Shizoon > Miki > Rin > Emi
Fav Character paths: Lilly = Hanako > Rin > Emi > Shizoon

I feel bad for Hanako cuz it seems that she's better off by the end of the game when you pick Lilly's route as opposed to her own.
Akira X Hanako shipper :3

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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Mirage_GSM » Fri Jan 06, 2012 7:37 pm

Actually I don't think choice points really mattered, for some reason I jumped bewteen different routes in act 1.
All the choice points matter. Some of them don't matter for every route, though. And you don't jump between different routes in Act 1. You are simply not set on one specific route yet for the majority of Act 1.
Apparently the people you have lunch with on the rooftop determines which route you are on, but I doubt that.
You get the lunch on the roof with Emi and Rin on every path but Shizune's.
I think the point which determined whether I went on Hanako's route or not was when you get the choice to hang out in the library or not or something
Yes, but at that point you only decide between Hanako's and Lilly's routes. At that point you are pretty much set on either of those two already
Emi > Misha > Hanako > Lilly > Rin > Shizune

My collected KS-Fan Fictions: Mirage's Myths
griffon8 wrote:Kosher, just because sex is your answer to everything doesn't mean that sex is the answer to everything.
Sore wa himitsu desu.

;_;

Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by ;_; » Fri Jan 06, 2012 9:05 pm

aw man
i went for hanako first and gladly got her good end...
all i can do is thank the people who realized this as reading it made me genuinely happy

so sad at times and such a nice ending
i absolutely love it

whatisthisfeelinginmyheart.jpg indeed
Rykn wrote:
It's kinda funny, I've played a bunch of VN's and for the first time I'm feeling apprehensive about going down another path. I'm thinking weird crap like how will Hanako ever be happy if someones not there for her....... If Hanako's writer reads this I want you to know that I thank you for giving me this wonderful treasure.
definitely
i guess i'll put KS on hold for a while before i can try another route

i'm not into this whole waifu thing but i guess after this i understand it a little better...

Jucez
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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Jucez » Fri Jan 06, 2012 10:43 pm

;_; wrote:aw man
i went for hanako first and gladly got her good end...
all i can do is thank the people who realized this as reading it made me genuinely happy

so sad at times and such a nice ending
i absolutely love it

whatisthisfeelinginmyheart.jpg indeed
Rykn wrote:
It's kinda funny, I've played a bunch of VN's and for the first time I'm feeling apprehensive about going down another path. I'm thinking weird crap like how will Hanako ever be happy if someones not there for her....... If Hanako's writer reads this I want you to know that I thank you for giving me this wonderful treasure.
definitely
i guess i'll put KS on hold for a while before i can try another route

i'm not into this whole waifu thing but i guess after this i understand it a little better...
whatisthisfeelinginmyheart.jpg indeed, on one hand i know i can't play any others routes now, but on the other hand i can't bring myself to close the game and start doing something else... I'm listening to the Ost 24/7 and when it comes to songs like "Shadow of the truth" or "Concord", my heart hurts so much :cry:... I'm lost.
Last edited by Jucez on Fri Jan 06, 2012 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Deltamon » Fri Jan 06, 2012 10:51 pm

Yubiseiharukana wrote:It may have already been posted here (if this is even the right place to post it), but I'm too lazy to read all 100+ prior posts to make sure. While going through Hanako's images in the gallery I notice that the image where Hanako receives her birthday presents has two parts, but I only have the first one. Is the second obtainable in Hanako's path, or is it through another character's path?
The second image is from Lilly's path, since she receives slightly different gifts.
Hanako = Shizune = Rin = Lilly = Emi
I just don't like categorizing people. Even if Hanako will always be the dearest for me, I still prefer if they all get equal share of love.

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Re: The Hanako Thread - Spoilers, obviously

Post by Misfile17 » Fri Jan 06, 2012 11:38 pm

All I can say about Hanako's route was that I loved it, Saying that I've loved all of them so far, I still have to take the Shizune path though.
I can honestly say this has been one of the most amazing experiences of my life, playing through this, The stories are amazing, the art is amazing, everything about it just works so well, I've cried my eyes out and laughed and smiled till my face aches, Something very few games/books/visual novels have been able to do so I think this is truely something special,

Sorry for ranting, I just kinda wanted to vent and get that off my chest, this seemed like the right place to do so xD

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