Bad end discussion topic

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Spindrift
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Spindrift » Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:23 am

Do you think it will be that difficult to avoid a bad end, if they're in there? I mean, it seemed to me that Act 1 encouraged a certain mode of behavior whose continuation will assure some good end or another, specifically: Pursue one girl instead of trying to be nice to everybody, pick honest and forthright answers instead of evasive ones, be assertive without being pushy. I figure if you stick to behavior like that, you'll be safe from bumbling into anything.

And what's more, you can always save before making a decision and reload if the answer you pick turns out to be a "Hisao Totally Freaks Out" sort of thing.
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BustRobot
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by BustRobot » Tue Feb 16, 2010 9:35 am

Spindrift wrote:Do you think it will be that difficult to avoid a bad end, if they're in there? I mean, it seemed to me that Act 1 encouraged a certain mode of behavior whose continuation will assure some good end or another, specifically: Pursue one girl instead of trying to be nice to everybody, pick honest and forthright answers instead of evasive ones, be assertive without being pushy. I figure if you stick to behavior like that, you'll be safe from bumbling into anything.

And what's more, you can always save before making a decision and reload if the answer you pick turns out to be a "Hisao Totally Freaks Out" sort of thing.

True enough; but even so, as things go on in later Acts there will likely be more difficult choices, even if you are being gently guided down a certain route.
Open up our narrow minds.

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Deimos
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Deimos » Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:48 am

Or you can, with some careful application of patience, wait for the flowchart or walkthrough. If these two only display the choices for the respective path, you will probably not be spoilered too much and can achieve a happy ending on our first go.

And before someone points it out, I will do so myself: Yes, it's technically cheating, but as they say:
"All is fair in love and war." :)
Ahh, Morticia? I would die for her. I would kill for her. Either way, what bliss.

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OriginalContent
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by OriginalContent » Tue Feb 16, 2010 4:32 pm

Deimos wrote:Or you can, with some careful application of patience, wait for the flowchart or walkthrough. If these two only display the choices for the respective path, you will probably not be spoilered too much and can achieve a happy ending on our first go.

And before someone points it out, I will do so myself: Yes, it's technically cheating, but as they say:
"All is fair in love and war." :)
I looked at the flowchart almost as soon as I'd starting playing Act 1 and immediately regretted it. I spent 6 hours non-stop reading through every single word of every single path, and felt dirty inside when I realised that I now had to wait for the whole game to come out to experience the same rush of novelty that the demo gave me. Consuming the whole game like that will be at least four thousand times worse, though, because I won't even be able to hold onto the fact that there'll be 5 more acts to come. I'm almost certain that pretty soon after the elation of completing the entire thing to 100% I'll suddenly feel incredibly morose and empty, and for that reason I want to prolong the experience of Katawa Shoujo as much as I possibly can.

tl;dr DON'T DO WHAT I DID OTHERWISE YOUR LIFE WILL LOSE MEANING MUCH MORE QUICKLY.
ThreeStep wrote:"No! I must stop the feminists!" he shouted.
"No, Kenji. You are the feminists," said Hisao.
And then Kenji was a woman.

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Deimos
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Deimos » Tue Feb 16, 2010 5:44 pm

OriginalContent wrote:[...] and for that reason I want to prolong the experience of Katawa Shoujo as much as I possibly can.
... by risking to make your beloved girls and Hisao unhappy ... by denying them the fastest route to bliss ... :|



In all honesty, I will also go for the bad ends (someday) but I do hope my first playthroughs will lead to the happy end of the girl I make Hisao pursue. They all deserve it.
Ahh, Morticia? I would die for her. I would kill for her. Either way, what bliss.

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OriginalContent
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by OriginalContent » Tue Feb 16, 2010 5:56 pm

Deimos wrote:
OriginalContent wrote:[...] and for that reason I want to prolong the experience of Katawa Shoujo as much as I possibly can.
... by risking to make your beloved girls and Hisao unhappy ... by denying them the fastest route to bliss ... :|



In all honesty, I will also go for the bad ends (someday) but I do hope my first playthroughs will lead to the happy end of the girl I make Hisao pursue. They all deserve it.
Shit, now I feel like a bastard. Damn, you've given me a full-blown internal struggle, and I'm only half-joking when I say that.
ThreeStep wrote:"No! I must stop the feminists!" he shouted.
"No, Kenji. You are the feminists," said Hisao.
And then Kenji was a woman.

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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by G3n0c1de » Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:10 pm

Some people might find a certain satisfaction in getting the good end unassisted. It adds an element of uncertainty, and if it works out you can be proud to say that you did it your way.
It's a good thing Shizune is deaf, she is the only one who can stand (not) hearing "Wahaha~!" over and over.

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Wreckusu
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Wreckusu » Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:15 pm

I'm too lazy and impatient to wait for a flowchart but I'll use it if it's there. The first run is always clean, then I resort to cheating as a time saver. Ended up with Emi on the first run anyway. Could have been worse. I'm prepared to work it all out by trial and error if I have to though.
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Bara
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Bara » Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:39 pm

I am definitely going to explore the full release on my own first for my own pleasure. Then, I know my obsessive compulsive tendencies will eventually go into overdrive and I'll head straight for the flowchart to get anything I've missed in my meandering.

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BustRobot
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by BustRobot » Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:26 pm

When the full release comes, I will definitely be running through the first time (at least) by myself. Being told the correct path for a VN does kind of spoil; perhaps not as much as a walkthrough telling you where to go and what to do, but it does take away some of the tension by you knowing, I think. Personally, I like the feeling of it being my own choices that shape the game, rather than being told how to "correctly" shape the game.
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raven8
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by raven8 » Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:47 pm

Spindrift wrote:Do you think it will be that difficult to avoid a bad end, if they're in there? I mean, it seemed to me that Act 1 encouraged a certain mode of behavior whose continuation will assure some good end or another, specifically: Pursue one girl instead of trying to be nice to everybody, pick honest and forthright answers instead of evasive ones, be assertive without being pushy. I figure if you stick to behavior like that, you'll be safe from bumbling into anything.

And what's more, you can always save before making a decision and reload if the answer you pick turns out to be a "Hisao Totally Freaks Out" sort of thing.
No, it won't likely be that difficult. Given that Act 1 has a bad end, and I actually never got it (got every girl's path without the bad end), I don't feel like 4LS is going to pull something like was done in "Pick Me, Honey!" or others, where making perfectly sane choices, and being good to the girls results in failing it. You mention lack of experience. For reference, there are any number of VNs and dating sims out there where getting what you want requires some complete bullshit, narrow as hell path from which you're likely to deviate at SOME point. I don't see that coming in KS, and the flowchart I looked at after the fact seems to use a much more logical method than strict paths--if if you've got X choices or more toward a girl, it goes toward that, as opposed to "do this then this then this then this then this." (That's not to say there aren't choices like that, as there certainly are; they just seem not to be using them to make navigation difficult.)
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Wokka
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Wokka » Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:18 am

I'm hoping for one or two School Days style bad ends. Seems a fitting response if you change girls late in the game.

Sometimes, to me, the bad ends really aren't that bad. In the Ryou/Kyou path in Clannad Ryou is considered the bad end though she's preferable over Kyou to me. in Family Project, the bad end means you end up with Rai (Rei, Kei, ?? can't remember the name, Jun's sister). Again, she was who I would have gone after if she'd had a path.

Then there's the whole good end/better end/true end like you see in Kana Little Sister. Where the good endings aren't that great and the normal end is the bad end (until you find the one that's even worse).


I usually play a game a couple times without help to try to learn the characters and get the ending I want. Then I get the walkthrough just so I can read all of the story. I spent 91 hours going through Fate/Stay Night, without the walkthrough I never would have made it. i had to go to the walkthrough on Clannad just to find out if I had the school life bad end for Nagisa only to find out it was the good end (bad end comes later). Clannad's another I wouldn't have gotten through without a walkthrough. It requires, I think, a minimum of 11 playthroughs just to get to the final good end.

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Smoku
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Smoku » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:27 pm

Wokka wrote:I'm hoping for one or two School Days style bad ends. Seems a fitting response if you change girls late in the game. Sometimes, to me, the bad ends really aren't that bad.
Um... as I recall it's the thing about killing in the end? the boat and such.
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Wokka
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Wokka » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:03 pm

Yep, that's it.

I figure if the devs are going to severely injure or kill off the main character in the Act 1 Bad End then it's reasonable to suspect that darker ends will exist in the full game. i don't think every path would have one but I think a couple characters could do it if betrayed and pushed far enough. I'm just cheering it on, but then i love horror movies and tend to root for the monsters.

"All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day. You had a bad day once. Am I right? You had a bad day and everything changed" Joker -- Batman: The Killing Joke

Wokka (who watched School Days solely to see the Bad End)
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Wreckusu
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Re: Bad end discussion topic

Post by Wreckusu » Thu Feb 18, 2010 3:23 pm

Wokka wrote:Yep, that's it.

I figure if the devs are going to severely injure or kill off the main character in the Act 1 Bad End then it's reasonable to suspect that darker ends will exist in the full game. i don't think every path would have one but I think a couple characters could do it if betrayed and pushed far enough. I'm just cheering it on, but then i love horror movies and tend to root for the monsters.

"All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day. You had a bad day once. Am I right? You had a bad day and everything changed" Joker -- Batman: The Killing Joke

Wokka (who watched School Days solely to see the Bad End)
It's a bit of a stretch to go from falling off a roof in a drunken stupor to multiple brutal murders followed by disturbing severed head fondling though. Personally I can do without that. I hope they don't include that ending simply so I don't have to consider that any of the girls could be capable of that. It'd really ruin the appeal of the game to learn that Emi, while normally sweet and cuddly will slice you up real nice if you so much as make googly eyes at Rin.

The bad end in act I was depressing yes but it didn't really spoil the game after seeing it. Seeing one of the girls go Yandere on Hisao though? I don't think I could play their path again if I saw that.
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