Anyone know when Lilly found out?

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Arcfault
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Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Arcfault » Fri Apr 17, 2020 3:45 pm

I'd forgotten my original username and pass from years ago, so asked this under the Ask! thread under a new username. Finally found my original account logins so figured I'd ask in general instead as I'm sure Suriko probably doesn't check back anymore.

I did several searches here, even Google'd, but couldn't find anyone asking this or mentioned it. I wondered if anyone knew when Lilly actually finds out Hisao had a heart attack and came back in her good ending?

Did she actually hear the commotion behind her and Akira and find out before the flight, or was it after she and Akira had left and someone (more than likely Hanako, or even Shizune) had called Lilly to tell her? I used to feel like it's before they left, but the fact that the music box doesn't show up in his room until a couple days later while he's in the hospital kinda makes me feel like it took time for her to find out (32 hours round trip, 16 hours one way I think she says in Hanako's storyline, so there's two days minimum accounted for). Plus the fact that his parents had come back and spent time with him after he came to again and didn't mention Lilly (or that Hisao's inner monologue doesn't mention, which he absolutely would've. Plus this is Lilly so his parents would've definitely mentioned a tall, attractive, blonde woman crying over him) kinda implies to me that she wasn't there at all yet. Based on her actions when he sees her enter the room and says her name, I'm also pretty confident that if she knew when it happened at the airport, she would've been in the ambulance with him (if possible), or followed behind in a taxi (or somehow found a way to follow the ambulance) and would've been there the whole time from his admittance.

It's just a question I've had for a long time, and doesn't impact my love for her character and storyline, but it's just a curiosity that gets me thinking once I stop crying from that damn music box fading in each time I play her storyline every few months.


On another note, I'm glad to see people still coming here and posting, but it's sad that the game nor this forum, doesn't have the fervor that we all had back in 2011/2012-2014. I hope that KS doesn't get swept away into obscurity. Because when you read the previous posts going all the way back, and see the tremendous impact a game created by users from 4chan about disabled girls had on hundreds if not thousands of players, the majority men from what I can tell, that's a game that should never be forgotten. Reading the old posts, even my own, about the depression we faced, the tears cried from the stories, even the people who did Emi's running challenge is something I really haven't seen since. And it's a f'ing damn shame that the world didn't see how truly impactful KS was on so many of our lives back then. This forum is a capsule of hope and support that I really wish everyone could experience.
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Emi->Hanako->Lilly->Rin->Shizune->Lilly->Lilly->Lilly-><sigh> What the hell just happened?

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Oddball
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Oddball » Fri Apr 17, 2020 10:25 pm

I've never seen any statement from anyone saying when Lilly found out. The fact that his parents don't mention it isn't a big deal either. He just woke back up. They probably didn't want to say anything to get him worked up. Asking about a blind lady can wait for later. Of course there's also a good chance that Lilly maybe have just introduced herself (or been introduced by Akira) as "a friend from school" in which case his parents probably didn't even think it was a big enough deal to mention.
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Arcfault
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Arcfault » Sat Apr 18, 2020 1:18 pm

Oddball wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 10:25 pm
I've never seen any statement from anyone saying when Lilly found out. The fact that his parents don't mention it isn't a big deal either. He just woke back up. They probably didn't want to say anything to get him worked up. Asking about a blind lady can wait for later. Of course there's also a good chance that Lilly maybe have just introduced herself (or been introduced by Akira) as "a friend from school" in which case his parents probably didn't even think it was a big enough deal to mention.
You know… those are some good points. I was basing everything off of Lilly's behavior in the hospital, but I think you're right.

Lilly's shell/wall would've been up in full force to keep her from completely losing it. Her thoughts that whole time would be "It's Hokkaido all over again". Plus, she'd wanted him to stop her or at least show her he actually loved/cared for her, and she got her wish but in the worst possible way. She also wouldn't want to meet his parents as she'd be in the worst possible headspace:
  • She still doesn't know what their relationship is now. She'd believed he wasn't serious about it, but then he did this so now she has no clue, and she despises a lack of control.
  • She's internally freaking out as she still loves him, and now realizes he might actually really love her too.
  • Memory of feeling utterly helpless the last time he had an attack in Hokkaido.
  • Feeling guilty as she'd wanted him to have some initiative in their relationship, and now when he did he nearly died.
  • She's too stubborn to let anyone see how she really feels, needs to be proper.
You're right. His parents would be focused on family first. Anyone else stopping by doesn't matter, and that's a good point that they wouldn't want to push anymore, since he just put himself back in the hospital for a second time. And I have to agree that Akira/Lilly would've kept introductions to just "we know him from Yamaku."

If she'd flown to Inverness, her parents might not let her fly back for some "supposed ex-boyfriend". Not saying their horrible people, but they did abandon her and Akira for six years (though they clearly pay for her tuition and provide a stipend so they're not completely heartless), and only now want their family together again.

She probably stayed with the Hakamichi's again, and stopped by every day to sit with him after his surgery was done. Hence why the music box wasn't there before, and was there when he came to the second time, she just happened to be visiting that time. Kinda makes me shudder to think how she's holding up while staying there. Trying to hold it together in public, but probably falling apart behind closed doors where she feels free to let it out.

Thanks for your response, makes perfect sense put that way.
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Mirage_GSM » Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:34 am

AfaIct there is only one line referring to that topic in the VN:
"I heard later that it happened as you were running down the road after me, right?"
That could mean 5 minutes later or a week later...

But personally I never even considered the possibility that Lilly might have left Japan and come back...
If so that would have had to be after a major conflict with her parents, and I'm certain something like that would have had to come up in *some* way.
Last edited by Mirage_GSM on Tue Apr 21, 2020 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
Emi > Misha > Hanako > Lilly > Rin > Shizune

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griffon8 wrote:Kosher, just because sex is your answer to everything doesn't mean that sex is the answer to everything.
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Razoredge » Tue Apr 21, 2020 10:28 am

Mirage_GSM wrote:
Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:34 am
AfaIct there is only one line referring to that topic in the LN
What do you mean by LN?

And I'm pretty sure she didn't leave Japan, for me it's a non-sense to leave a country and come back right after.
Lilly = Akira > Miki = Hanako > Emi > Rin > Shizune

Stuff I'm currently writing : Beyond the haze : A Lilly Satou pseudo-route, Razor's One Shots & misc. & Sakura Blossom

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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Mirage_GSM » Tue Apr 21, 2020 10:52 am

Typo. Fixed. I just read so many more LNs than VNs these days...
Emi > Misha > Hanako > Lilly > Rin > Shizune

My collected KS-Fan Fictions: Mirage's Myths
griffon8 wrote:Kosher, just because sex is your answer to everything doesn't mean that sex is the answer to everything.
Sore wa himitsu desu.

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Arcfault
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Arcfault » Tue Apr 21, 2020 9:50 pm

And I'm pretty sure she didn't leave Japan, for me it's a non-sense to leave a country and come back right after.
I thought that too, but I'd considered that this is also Lilly we're talking about. She's a hopeless romantic at heart, and the only thing she'd wanted was for Hisao to take an active part in their relationship, but he'd only just numbly went along, only once really asking if she was all right.

If she kept walking and not realized what the commotion was behind her, then found out he nearly died again chasing after her either when they were airborne or after they landed, she'd be beside herself. In that scenario, what she wanted had actually happened, but now the love of her life who finally tried to take an active role in their relationship nearly died again like in Hokkaido. Since she comes from a wealthy family, it wouldn't be financially out of the realm of possible that she could return to be back with the guy who just proved her wrong (in that he did love her). Logistically it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility. If I found out someone I loved had nearly died while I was in flight, I'd try to find the fastest way back.

However, after time-lining this out, I'm not so sure she left anymore.

His time in the hospital at the end is a little indeterminate, but what I did find out was:
  • Hisao wakes up the first time during the day, and after dozing is told it's been two days since the incident and that his parents had just left.
  • He then wakes up again (we're not told how long has passed since the first time) and we're told, by Hisao's inner monologue, that his parents had visited and watched TV while they waited for him to wake up. Since the doctor had asked if Hisao wanted his parents to come back earlier, I assumed that was the same day (which would still be two days post incident). This is described by Hisao during the time the music box is starting to fade in after he wakes up the second time.
  • As Mirage_GSM pointed out about Lilly's dialogue (thanks for that BTW, I'd apparently glossed over it): "I heard later that it happened as you were running down the road after me, right?", that could be within minutes, or days later (which I'd taken for days later originally.
Being that her above line of dialogue is ambiguous enough, I can now see the following sequence of events:
Lilly and Akira are walking into the terminal as shown in the image. Lilly either hears Hisao's screaming her name, or she heard all of the commotion behind her and Akira either saw immediately or found out from someone what had happened. Lilly's beside herself because why the hell is Hisao there at the airport and is now on his way to the hospital again? Akira asks around what happened and someone from the crowd says "this guy was running and shoving through us shouting this girls name, trying to stop her. And then he accidentally got knocked to the ground and he had a heart attack". Akira tells Lilly this and since they're not relatives they can't stay or see him until he's cleared for visitors. They head back to the Hakamichi residence and stay there until Hisao is cleared, after his parents have left from visiting him.
But personally I never even considered the possibility that Lilly might have left Japan and come back...
If so that would have had to be after a major conflict with her parents, and I'm certain something like that would have had to come up in *some* way.
As Oddball pointed out, there's solid rationale as to her not leaving and finding out before her flight. But I agree that her leaving and returning would've made for some hell of a confrontation with her parents, over how important a boyfriend is over her family. In a sense though, it does kinda validate what Akira says in the Epilogue, about their father "being out for her blood" for being in Japan for too long while she tried to get a passport for her boyfriend.

Thanks everyone for helping me work through this. I spend way too long thinking about this stuff sometimes.
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Mirage_GSM » Wed Apr 22, 2020 5:27 am

She's a hopeless romantic at heart, and the only thing she'd wanted was for Hisao to take an active part in their relationship, but he'd only just numbly went along, only once really asking if she was all right.
Boy, does this not jive with my impression of Lilly. :lol:
I don't think *any* of the girls qualify as "hopeless romantic" but if I had to rank them Lilly doesn't take last place only because the list has Rin in it...
Emi > Misha > Hanako > Lilly > Rin > Shizune

My collected KS-Fan Fictions: Mirage's Myths
griffon8 wrote:Kosher, just because sex is your answer to everything doesn't mean that sex is the answer to everything.
Sore wa himitsu desu.

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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Arcfault » Wed Apr 22, 2020 11:49 am

Mirage_GSM I believe you're right. I've been diving a lot into the fan fiction, and I think I'm picking up some of their interpretations of her character.

My interpretation of Lilly is as follows:
Lilly is extremely complex, in that she tries to carry herself with grace and propriety, being that she came from a prominent family and from a Catholic school. The fact that her family doesn't live in the same country, means that she's concerned that they could pull her and Akira out of Japan at anytime (which does happen in the game), so she keeps everyone at a respectable distance. She uses that grace, stoic-ness, and propriety as a shield.

When Hisao starts hanging with her and Hanako, she treats him the same as everyone else. But unlike everyone else, Hisao is persistent. She's forced to begin to deal with feelings she had kept apart from herself. I think this is where the "hopeless romantic" becomes misinterpreted. While in Scotland, she forced to confront her feelings for Hisao, and then on top of it she's told she needs to leave Japan. Her greatest fear now confirmed.

Then, Hisao's carelessness leads to another terrifying moment that Lilly was not prepared for. Standing on the road unable to see, Hanako not telling her what's going on, the only thing she can go by are the sounds of Hisao's pain, it had to have been terrifying for her. It forced her to confront a lot of emotions she'd tried to suppress, both relational and familial.

I think this then leads to what could/can be perceived as a "whirlwind romance". The relationship between herself, Hisao, and Hanako blurs the lines she'd drawn for herself, as she's trying to both experience as much of the emotions in the relationship as possible, akin to marriage. She's hoping to get some reason from Hisao to tell her to stay, to help him take an active role in their relationship, and to share the burden and frustration she's carrying. Unfortunately he doesn't, leading to the Shanghai scene where it all falls apart.

Finally, she gives up and leaves for the airport. I agree with many, that deep down she wanted him to stop her. To say something before she got in the car. Yet Hisao doesn't. He's resigned himself to losing her (I honestly can't fault him though. Would I think that I have any importance over her father and mother, as just the boyfriend?).

He eventually realizes his lack of active participation in the relationship, beyond just going along with what she wanted (he refused to even pick their first date), is what drove the stake between them. Why she couldn't trust him fully, even though she was trying to draw him out and join her emotionally.


Mirage_GSM you're absolutely right and it was the wrong verbiage to use. I think ultimately it's the sudden change (desperation even) of Lilly's behaviors, spurred by a deadline unknown to Hisao, that can make her appear as a "hopeless romantic". Ultimately I think it's why I love her character the most, she understands the importance of perception and propriety, but comes to accept that ignoring her feelings and emotions towards others causes more pain than just dealing with them in the first place.
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Mirage_GSM » Wed Apr 22, 2020 6:08 pm

He's resigned himself to losing her (I honestly can't fault him though. Would I think that I have any importance over her father and mother, as just the boyfriend?).
Well, it's not just that...
She also just showed him that she doesn't care for his feelings at all by first starting a relationship with him and then preparing to leave the country forever without even telling him about it for weeks until her sister takes pity and clues him in just two or three days before she actually leaves. If not for Akira she might have phoned him from Scotland.
I don't think anybody would think someone has actual feelings for them after something like that.
Emi > Misha > Hanako > Lilly > Rin > Shizune

My collected KS-Fan Fictions: Mirage's Myths
griffon8 wrote:Kosher, just because sex is your answer to everything doesn't mean that sex is the answer to everything.
Sore wa himitsu desu.

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Arcfault
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Arcfault » Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:32 pm

Yeesh. That's a very good point. I think I was able to ignore most of that because she keeps saying that she hadn't actually decided yet. That she was trying to figure it out still. Though waiting until a couple days before you have to leave to choose doesn't make sense from a logistical perspective. It's like she was hoping that everything could resolve itself on its own.

Ultimately, I still think Hisao should've spoken up any of the times that he saw something was wrong. In a way it's choosing to live in ignorance, as he kinda alludes to in his soliloquy in the hospital at the end. At the very least it could've gotten everything out in the open much earlier. Forced her to finally open up and say everything out loud. Maybe it would actually confront her with how her actions have been, instead of how she perceives them to be.

She's absolutely in the wrong, and unfortunately that paints everything she feels in the worst possible way. I had to admit that the whole thing when it got to the Shanghai scene, I was like "were you just using him to take your mind off of everything?" It's hard not to try and give her the benefit of the doubt, but yeah, not telling your boyfriend you're leaving is the absolute shittiest thing to do. Kinda sucks because I loved her character so much.
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Oddball » Fri Apr 24, 2020 3:40 pm

Lilly doesn't want to ever be seen as a burden or problem for anyone. So when confronted with a situation where she would let somebody down no matter what she did, she had no idea how to handle it. I think she was holding off in the vain hopes that something would happen where she wouldn't have to make a decision. There would be some last minute miracle to get her out of her jam.

And there wasn't.

Hisao problem is that he fell for Lilly's "perfect girl" image. The idea that she would even have problems didn't occur to them. She had everything under control.
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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Akko2099 » Sat Apr 25, 2020 9:03 pm

Probably the people in the airport told Akira. There was a lot of noise and there is no way Lilly didn't hear people gasping and yelling "Someone call a doctor" or something.
She couldn't go with him, so she should have gone with Shizune and either calling the hospital or going there once a day to ask again.


also -.-
Well, it's not just that...
She also just showed him that she doesn't care for his feelings at all by first starting a relationship with him and then preparing to leave the country forever without even telling him about it for weeks until her sister takes pity and clues him in just two or three days before she actually leaves. If not for Akira she might have phoned him from Scotland.
I don't think anybody would think someone has actual feelings for them after something like that.
This is the reason Lilly is not my best girl.
She was an asshole by confessing to Hisao when she knew she will leave the country, why even trying? Did she want to just have fun before leaving? that choice was so selfish of her.

To be fair, Hisao should have known something, he knew about her family, he knew the end of school was close. Was Lilly just going to live in the city? where? in Hokkaido? He didn't know a thing about her future.
Rin > Hanako > Lilly > Emi > Misha > Saki > Miki > Yuuko > Akira > Hideaki > Kenji > Shizune

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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Mirage_GSM » Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:56 am

Ultimately, I still think Hisao should've spoken up any of the times that he saw something was wrong.
Remember when Hisao did speak up (after his talk with Akira and a ouple of days before the plane was scheduled to leave)?
Akira had already put most ofher affairs in order, the plane tickets were bought... And Lilly still denied anything was wrong until Hisao confronted her with the truth.
And the icing on the cake is that Lilly's route is all about honesty: All choices in her route are about Hisao always telling her everything about himself without reservation, otherwise bye bye good ending.
Sometimes I wonder if Suriko was trolling us with this...
Emi > Misha > Hanako > Lilly > Rin > Shizune

My collected KS-Fan Fictions: Mirage's Myths
griffon8 wrote:Kosher, just because sex is your answer to everything doesn't mean that sex is the answer to everything.
Sore wa himitsu desu.

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Re: Anyone know when Lilly found out?

Post by Akko2099 » Sun Apr 26, 2020 5:43 pm

And the icing on the cake is that Lilly's route is all about honesty: All choices in her route are about Hisao always telling her everything about himself without reservation, otherwise bye bye good ending.
Sometimes I wonder if Suriko was trolling us with this...
Fuck. I never thought of that. Fuck Lilly, now she's in my third place.
She could even tell Hisao way before confessing. Or maybe she knew that if she came out, no way in hell would Hisao started a relationship with her.
Rin > Hanako > Lilly > Emi > Misha > Saki > Miki > Yuuko > Akira > Hideaki > Kenji > Shizune

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